What do you think the New Alliance did with the Ur-quan?

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Lukipela
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Re: What do you think the New Alliance did with the Ur-quan?

Post by Lukipela » Wed Sep 08, 2010 3:25 pm

I sort of liked the irony they used and how clear they made it that they really really loathed you. But I agree that setting them up as backstabbers made very little sense. A very humorous moment would've been if it turned out that you were stuck with one functioning loyal race - the guys that hate your guts.

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Re: What do you think the New Alliance did with the Ur-quan?

Post by Draxas » Wed Sep 08, 2010 4:14 pm

Mormont wrote:Yeah, making the VUX stupid bumbling backstabbers was dumb. They always seemed to me like the most disciplined slave race except maybe the Androsynth. They would have been the best choice to guard the moon, really.
I think the Ur-Quan picked the Spathi and Ilwrath because they both really had little vested interest in trying to harm Humans (beyond the Ilwarth desire to sacrifice them, but that extends to everyone and the Ilwarth were pretty well cowed by the Ur-Quan anyway). The Androsynth and VUX both had fairly personal grudges against humanity, and the Mycon and Umgah are pretty poor choices for guard duty no matter who we're discussing.
Lukipela wrote:I sort of liked the irony they used and how clear they made it that they really really loathed you. But I agree that setting them up as backstabbers made very little sense. A very humorous moment would've been if it turned out that you were stuck with one functioning loyal race - the guys that hate your guts.
Another missed opportunity courtosey of SC3. Of course, considering how contrived some of the reasons for crippling your other allies were, I would have hated to see what they would have done to the human colonists.

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Re: What do you think the New Alliance did with the Ur-quan?

Post by chenjesuwizard » Wed Sep 08, 2010 4:45 pm

Why are there no guards by the Syreen and Chenjesu Homeworlds?

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Re: What do you think the New Alliance did with the Ur-quan?

Post by Lukipela » Wed Sep 08, 2010 5:43 pm

chenjesuwizard wrote:Why are there no guards by the Syreen and Chenjesu Homeworlds?
Well, the Syreen are pretty close to the Ur-Quan and were possibly watched over by the Androsynth before they were wiped out.

Can't recall if the ilwrath were monitoring the Chenjesu homeworld all along? Otherwise it's a good question.

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Re: What do you think the New Alliance did with the Ur-quan?

Post by Draxas » Wed Sep 08, 2010 11:06 pm

The Syreen were right on the border of Ur-Quan space, and were also considered more trustworthy than the other Alliance races anyway, so guards were probably not deemed necessary. The Chenjesu and Mmrnmhrm were supposed to be under observation by the Ilwrath (and they finally remember that duty if you haven't properly distracted them near the end of SC2), but just like with Earth, they got bored and left to go kill things.

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Re: What do you think the New Alliance did with the Ur-quan?

Post by chenjesuwizard » Thu Sep 09, 2010 6:55 am

Ok, another question.
When you visit Vela and meet the Ur-quan there, he said he located you entering Hyperspace. Why don't they notice this in Bettlegeuse, I mean, it's closer than Vela to Ur-quan Space. I think you can encounter an Ur-quan next to it. I'm not sure.

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Re: What do you think the New Alliance did with the Ur-quan?

Post by Mormont » Thu Sep 09, 2010 2:11 pm

I think the Ur-Quan picked the Spathi and Ilwrath because they both really had little vested interest in trying to harm Humans (beyond the Ilwarth desire to sacrifice them, but that extends to everyone and the Ilwarth were pretty well cowed by the Ur-Quan anyway). The Androsynth and VUX both had fairly personal grudges against humanity, and the Mycon and Umgah are pretty poor choices for guard duty no matter who we're discussing.
Well, yes, the VUX and Androsynth do have their grudges. But the Ilwrath and Spathi are both pretty unreliable and unstable as we can see in the game, likely to run off and do their own thing. The VUX do have a grudge, but they seem like the most disciplined and dependable of the hierarchy races too. Except maybe the Androsynth, who we don't really know much about after their early history.

On the other hand, I guess the Ur-quan expected that they just keep an eye on the Ilwrath and Spathi and make sure they didn't run off or otherwise cause problems. But of course, after the Kohr-ah returned they pretty much stopped paying to attention to slave races.

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Re: What do you think the New Alliance did with the Ur-quan?

Post by Lukipela » Thu Sep 09, 2010 5:00 pm

Hey Mormont, long time no see. While I think the reasoning going on here is otherwise good, I still wonder why the humans needed two races to guide them and the Chenjesu/M:bots only needed one. That seems odd, seeing as those were the heavy hitters.

Regarding the Syreen and detection, probably just dumb luck or the Kzer-Za in that region being too distracted.

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Re: What do you think the New Alliance did with the Ur-quan?

Post by oldlaptop » Thu Sep 09, 2010 5:18 pm

Mormont wrote: They [the VUX] would have been the best choice to guard the moon, really.
Taking combat effectiveness into account, probably not. Unless an Intruder gets to use its warp-in feature, a Cruiser will pretty much roll right over it. Avengers and Eluders are far more effective.
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Re: What do you think the New Alliance did with the Ur-quan?

Post by Mormont » Thu Sep 09, 2010 6:38 pm

Taking combat effectiveness into account, probably not. Unless an Intruder gets to use its warp-in feature, a Cruiser will pretty much roll right over it. Avengers and Eluders are far more effective.
The Ur-quan destroy or confiscate the fleets of slaveshielded races (and it seems like they're pretty thorough about it), so I don't think ship-to-ship effectiveness is much of a concern. If they did their job, the slaves left to monitor them would stop any shenanigans like attempting to construct a ship before it got anywhere.
I still wonder why the humans needed two races to guide them and the Chenjesu/M:bots only needed one. That seems odd, seeing as those were the heavy hitters.
Probably because the Chenjesu/Mmrnmhrm are closer to Ilwrath territory than the Ilwrath/Spathi are to earth.

Actually, on the subject of the Syreen, it seems a little odd to me that the Ur-quan are pretty lenient to them. Talana hardly even minds being a thrall until the Mycon enter the picture. They're psychic - even if their powers are much less than the Dnyarri, wouldn't that make them a particularly dangerous and suspect race for the Ur-quan? It's even in the SC1 manual, before they thought up the Ur-quan backstory (probably).

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