Sequels strife

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vok3
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Re: Sequels strife

Post by vok3 » Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:14 pm

For anyone who happens to check here before seeing it in the UQM forums or reddit, Stardock is now claiming ownership of UQM.

I sincerely and deeply regret every single word I ever wrote or spoke in defense of Brad Wardell. I utterly misjudged the man. He's a criminal and a thief, nothing more.

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Quasispatial
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Re: Sequels strife

Post by Quasispatial » Wed Oct 17, 2018 7:06 am

Well shit. The sad story of the man who didn't get what he wanted and therefore turned increasingly nasty in the pursuit of the goals in question just took an even worse turn.

Guess I'm boycotting Stardock now.
"Sentient life. We are the Ur-Quan. Independence is intolerable. Blah, blah, blah." - the Spathi High Council, Star Control II.

Elestan
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Re: Sequels strife

Post by Elestan » Wed Oct 17, 2018 1:23 pm

vok3 wrote:
Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:14 pm
For anyone who happens to check here before seeing it in the UQM forums or reddit, Stardock is now claiming ownership of UQM.
To be precise, they are claiming that Paul and Fred did not own the copyrights to UQM, and therefore could not have legitimately open-sourced it in the first place, and that Stardock owns trademarks on the phrase "Ur-Quan Masters" and on the names of all of the aliens such that UQM can't use them.

They aren't technically claiming that they own the UQM copyright themselves, but if the court takes Stardock's side on these questions and issues the injunction Stardock wants, Stardock could start sending notices to hosting sites to get it taken down.

Which is basically what Brad threatened to do privately, but then assured us he was just venting.

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Re: Sequels strife

Post by glory_device » Wed Oct 17, 2018 3:26 pm

Elestan, do you have any news regarding on how the proceedings are going? I know that both parties asked for delays..but we're looking at how much time here ? At what step this cause is at the moment?
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Specifically, they pried me from the doorjamb, and rolled me into the street.'' -Fwiffo

Elestan
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Re: Sequels strife

Post by Elestan » Thu Oct 18, 2018 2:47 am

glory_device wrote:
Wed Oct 17, 2018 3:26 pm
Elestan, do you have any news regarding on how the proceedings are going? I know that both parties asked for delays..but we're looking at how much time here ? At what step this cause is at the moment?
The revised scheduling order puts the trial on August 25, 2019. The parties have just filed what should have been their final versions of their complaints. However, as P&F have now added Valve and GoG to their countersuit, the introduction of those two parties could result in further delays.

Suffice it to say that it's not likely to end soon. My best guess is that there might be another shot at a settlement next April. By that point, the judge will have made preliminary rulings on some of their claims, such that they may be better able to gauge what parts of each side's case are stronger and weaker.

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Draxas
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Re: Sequels strife

Post by Draxas » Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:52 pm

Draxas wrote:
Wed Mar 21, 2018 3:39 am
And you'll note, Stardock wants UQM now in addition to the classic SC games. I'd suggest everyone that doesn't have a copy, grab one soon before the Cease and Desist shows up.
I am disappointed to have called this all the way back in March. I will have to make a point to redownload the latest version tonight.

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sakalava47
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Re: Sequels strife

Post by sakalava47 » Thu Oct 25, 2018 8:31 pm

Don't be too hard on Brad. Once the lawyers get involved it's all out war and the lawyers are probably doing strategy. Source: I'm a lawyer.

I, for one, thought it was kind of weaselly how Fred and Paul waited until someone else was investing tons of money into a new Star Control game and then they FINALLY came out and said they're making a "real" sequel. Imagine you were in Brad's or Stardock's position. It would feel like a kick in the nuts. It would do serious damage to your credibility and divide the fan base. Which is what it did. My respect for Fred and Paul isn't that high right now.

BTW, does anyone know how sales are for Origins? I haven't played it and I'm wondering if I should buy it. No spoilers please.

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Post by metamorphosis » Fri Oct 26, 2018 4:11 am

sakalava47 wrote:
Thu Oct 25, 2018 8:31 pm
Don't be too hard on Brad. Once the lawyers get involved it's all out war and the lawyers are probably doing strategy. Source: I'm a lawyer.

I, for one, thought it was kind of weaselly how Fred and Paul waited until someone else was investing tons of money into a new Star Control game and then they FINALLY came out and said they're making a "real" sequel. Imagine you were in Brad's or Stardock's position. It would feel like a kick in the nuts. It would do serious damage to your credibility and divide the fan base. Which is what it did. My respect for Fred and Paul isn't that high right now.

BTW, does anyone know how sales are for Origins? I haven't played it and I'm wondering if I should buy it. No spoilers please.
Watch the zero punctuation review.
However, you should read the stuff that Brad's said in private. It's unpretty.
TFB sequel was always planned, Stardock always knew that. Hence the separate universes.

Fun video here of P&F discussing the other contributors to SC2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hw_lnnt52EY

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Dyandod
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Re: Sequels strife

Post by Dyandod » Sat Oct 27, 2018 6:53 am

sakalava47 wrote:
Thu Oct 25, 2018 8:31 pm
I, for one, thought it was kind of weaselly how Fred and Paul waited until someone else was investing tons of money into a new Star Control game and then they FINALLY came out and said they're making a "real" sequel. Imagine you were in Brad's or Stardock's position. It would feel like a kick in the nuts. It would do serious damage to your credibility and divide the fan base. Which is what it did. My respect for Fred and Paul isn't that high right now.
Fred and Paul were a little uncouth with that announcement and the timing was bad for Stardock but I don't see them as being "weaselly".

The timing makes sense to me. Fred and Paul have been saying over and over throughout the years that they were going to come back to Star Control, they just had to find the time. Remember they were in charge of Skylanders which is one of the biggest kids gaming franchises in recent history, so they obviously couldn't work on SC during those years. After many releases, Skylanders finally seemed to be ramping down a couple years ago, so their timing of being able to get back to SC makes perfect sense.

I also have no doubt they've been sincerely planning to get back to SC. I had a comic strip I made that I've been thinking of turning into a point-and-click adventure game. Although I'm busy with life right now and I really doubt I'll be able to do anything with it for several years, I still think about it several times a week, trying to come up with ideas. I'm sure Fred and Paul have been the same way the past 25 years, it's just what creative minds do.

There are certain things F+P have said that have caught me off guard but overall I can't put too much blame on them.
KYAAAAAIIIIIIIIIEEEEEEEE!

Spaceport

Re: Sequels strife

Post by Spaceport » Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:33 pm

sakalava47 wrote:
Thu Oct 25, 2018 8:31 pm
I, for one, thought it was kind of weaselly how Fred and Paul waited until someone else was investing tons of money into a new Star Control game and then they FINALLY came out and said they're making a "real" sequel. Imagine you were in Brad's or Stardock's position. It would feel like a kick in the nuts. It would do serious damage to your credibility and divide the fan base. Which is what it did. My respect for Fred and Paul isn't that high right now.
Imagine you're Fred and Paul. You've always wanted to create a sequel to Star Control II, but due to poor working conditions with Accolade you had to step away and, after putting your efforts elsewhere, you were unable to convince Activision to let you return to Star Control. All the while you were always very open with fans. You open sourced SCII to keep awareness of the property high and grow the fanbase, you asked the fans to petition Activision to try to let them know that interest in such an old property was high enough to make returning to it worthwhile, and when an interloper came along and bought the "Star Control" trademark, you explained to him that you had your own plans for continuing the story and that you had your own 25th anniversary announcement plans.

Here is Brad asking to coordinate something with F&P for the anniversary:

8. We are still hoping to release Star Control: Origins in 2018 in time for the 25th anniversary of Star Control 2.
9. We would also like to release an update to Star Control 1/2 under the existing agreement (50/50) split if we can get your permission for the 25th anniversary.
10. Would you be able to participate in any Star Control: 25th anniversary events next year? There are many people, such as myself, who would not have become game developers if it weren't for you two.


Brad additionally asked them to do an interview. To this Paul responded by politely declining and informing him that he had his own plans:

Hi Brad,
Fred and I appreciate the update! In regards to the interview, I think we are going to save our powder (and really limited time) for our own anniversary plans ‐‐ which we are not quite ready to talk about ‐‐ closer to November.

Thanks,
‐ Paul


You asked us to imagine what Brad would think, well, we may not have access to the inner workings of his mind, but he do have him expressing his support for P&F doing their own thing:

Hi Paul,
Sounds good. Please let me know how we might assist. We would love to help with any promotion or support we can give!
Cheers,
Brad


Despite Paul explicitly saying no to an interview, Brad followed that up by asking again and sending along a list of questions. He ended that email with this:

You mentioned you have some announcements of your own coming up. Please feel free to send anything you want me to promote through our channels. Heck, even if you were leaving Activision and making Ur‐Quan: The Revenge or something we'd be delighted to help spread the word.

Full emails and email exchange located here: https://www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov ... 64.10.pdf
So Brad figured out, on his own, that F&P might be planning their own sequel, which he expressed support for before the public announcement and without any direct confirmation from F&P. Even if he was secretly dreading such an action, he signaled his approval for them to go ahead with that. I do not see how F&P should have any obligation to delay their plans or run them through a company who, in an effort to capitalize on their work and "goodwill," bought the trademark (Stardock had no deal with P&F and had to reasonably expect that their purchase came with risks like this), but even if you think that they do, they had Brad's explicit backing for both putting out their own announcement and for it being about a sequel while Stardock was ramping up its own promotion. Brad later attempted to spin this situation to make himself look like an aggrieved party to people who were not privy to these emails.

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