Draxas wrote:You guys are really going to town on a very minor point in a universe that is well understood to run on the Rule of Funny (to use another trope term) most of the time. I think you're both missing the bigger picture: Both the Melnorme and Slylandro are written as "lighter" races to provide a bit of comic relief in most of their dialog. You're both really getting fixated on seriously interpreting lines that are supposed to make the player laugh more than anything else.
I acknowlegde that a lot of the lines are funny. But that doesn't mean they're meaningless
The idea that 'My interpretation is right, and if the text of the game disagrees with me, I chalk it up as lazy/bad writing or just a joke'. Is not an idea I take seriously.
Also if the Melnorme are morally neutral they clearly cannot show any good side of capitalism. (Which I also don't think they do, because I see them as barterers rather then capitalists. They trade goods or information for goods and information of comparable valuable. (Such as info on aliens for info on rainbow worlds.)
Also the Melnorme DO show traits that show they are not omnicompetent. That Probe, because of the way it acted DID malfunction due to it's poor design (Allowing it to so easily be set in a way that it'd malfunction.)
Also the Melnorme, though they want their tat for their tit, CAN be compassionate such as this quote shows;
Since you have no useful, easily removeable equipment on your vessel
we have decided to provide you with fuel at no cost.
Please do not make the mistake of thinking of this as a `gift' or act of altruism
we are merely investing in our relationship with you, the customer.
We are certain that in the long run, this will prove to be a most profitable investment.
This shows they are willing to give to someone who cannot give them anything back, provided the long term benefits outweigh the costs. (Which is a smart strategy.) And it shows they're not ruthless Ayn Randian social darwinists types or anything like that. (In fact though I often got the feeling that people with libertarian sympathies (sure as hell not ME, I have NO such sympathies) particularly like the Melnorme they show no particular interest in individuality uber allesch. (Thus such an interpretation of the Melnorme is demonstrably incorrect.)
I think the Melnorme are generally serious about wanting to exchange things. But this shows they're not utterly rigid about it. (And also puts them closer to the 'face' catagory as characters, rather then neutrals.)
Look, people can believe what they want, but at least I can back up what I believe about it by my interpretation of the game text. A different interpretation that dismisses the game text is as such inherently less valid. Because mine is based on the game, and theirs is based on personal preferences, dismissing parts of the game as insignificant when it suits them.
This doesn't mean they're not entitled to that view. Just that if they where reasonable they'd have to admit, I got a stronger base for it. Because I go WITH the text, and they DISMISS the text if they like it.
Also another quote that the Melnorme aren't 100% angelic;
We regret to say that you have exhausted our supply of genuinely valuable information.
However, we DO have many thousands of useless facts that we will gladly sell you
at a substantial discount. Are you interested?
We thought not.
Sure, they know they can't sell YOU crap (And thus never give you a waiver like they did the Slylandro (Which means they KNEW it could go wrong, and hence they needed the waiver.)
Look, I dunno how people interpret the Melnorme, but I interpret them the way they are PRESENTED in the game.
Affable, friendly enough, valuing their neutrality, barterers who want tit for tat, but who are not completely above a little cheating if it suits them and who CAN be incompetent, even if as a whole they're a competent and advanced species.
I think that's exactly how the Melnorme act, based on their quotes, other quotes about them and the way the game flows. Even a joke says something about a species, it is part of their character. A joke that fits their personality, and that makes the joke work. Jokes are not JUST jokes. SC2 humour fits each race, not 'rule of funny' alone. Like the Ilwrath have a very dark brutal sort of humour. Which says something about their species.
If someone has a real argument to dispute any of that, please make it. (preferably without being smug and condescending to me.) But let this argument be based on game text. Because I don't give a wet slap about someone's personal preference.
I also already acknowledged in another discussion about the Mycon that I thought one of my opponents made good points. I just still thought mine where better and backed up why I thought so.
But if your argument is 'I'm right, if the game says something else I dismiss it'. There's no point for me to talking to you and I can't really put any value on your opinion, because you don't back it up.
You can also elect NOT to talk with me if you don't want this. That's fine. Just ignore me then.