Card-Control: The Ur-Quan Masters

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glory_device
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Re: Card-Control: The Ur-Quan Masters

Post by glory_device » Thu May 26, 2016 1:06 pm

it's basically trial and error...we just gotta get a simple ruleset going and once this is available test it out to see how it feels.

if you put like 1 planet or 2 on a whole map it can be pretty interesting ...coverage and occlusion will greatly enhance the feel of the game.

Shall we include asteroid in this discussion?
''I swiftly matured into a fine example of my species and with my parents' assistance, achieved independence.
Specifically, they pried me from the doorjamb, and rolled me into the street.'' -Fwiffo

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The Troglodyte
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Re: Card-Control: The Ur-Quan Masters

Post by The Troglodyte » Thu May 26, 2016 2:59 pm

Dyandod wrote:Oh my, I will have to try this out soon. Looks fun, Quasi!
The game is loads of fun!! You'll really like it!
glory_device wrote:it's basically trial and error...we just gotta get a simple ruleset going and once this is available test it out to see how it feels.
I think it’s worth pointing out that the game set-up greatest benefit is the opportunity to see what would happen if multiple ships are able to be used in combat with their inherent capabilities, and so far I’ve enjoyed what I’ve seen -- I think that it's beginning to really shine through the more the game progresses and the closer we examine it and "tinker".

But with everything gained there’s always something lost. In this case, the most pronounced part of gameplay that has changed is the reflex part of game strategy. In other words, the ability to think on the fly and left motor skills guide you to victory is simply not part of the equation in this format. There’s room for strategical forward thinking though, and since it has started coming up more often in discussion, I think it’s worth taking a closer looksy.

The good part about the current rules in terms of movement phase is that it’s a simple approach and allows quick positioning, but I feel it favors the fast ships since they are allowed to wait and see what the slower ships do before positioning themselves in either an ideal offensive location or a quick getaway if they’re in danger or need to recharge.

Inertia would level the playing field, but it would unfortunately require re-tooling the movement mechanics altogether. Instead of mobility score with turn cost subtracting from the MS, you’d have to go back to Star Control fundamentals, and replace those with acceleration, turn rate, and max velocity. Then, during the movement phase, the results of thrust applied would determine how far a ship would travel, but, depending on how much thrust was used, it would carry over to the next round, similar to how glory_device described with Centurion, but it could be made to operate almost as easy as the current ruleset.

Then of course, the planet situation solves itself, and can then be applied as a variable that’s applied by a simple gravitation pull bonus/penalty, and special rules are no longer needed quite as much.

This of course is just brainstorming stuff I’m throwing out there. I don’t mind the current movement one bit, but I think it could also bring a little more of the reflexive part of gameplay if inertia was applied to movement, as long as it’s not too complicated.
“He tasks me. He tasks me, and I shall have him! I’ll chase him ’round the moons of Nibia and ’round the Antares maelstrom and ’round Perdition’s flames before I give him up!” ― Khan Noonien Singh

glory_device
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Re: Card-Control: The Ur-Quan Masters

Post by glory_device » Thu May 26, 2016 3:56 pm

The Troglodyte wrote: The good part about the current rules in terms of movement phase is that it’s a simple approach and allows quick positioning, but I feel it favors the fast ships since they are allowed to wait and see what the slower ships do before positioning themselves in either an ideal offensive location or a quick getaway if they’re in danger or need to recharge.
We tested the fast ship move first type of thing and it actually made even less sense... since you needed to plan ahead gaps for possible limpets or anything similar. Fast, short range ships could be kitted easily by the slowest ships. Easiest example was the Arilou: you close in on your target...but it moves away since it is slower than you in almost all cases.

Fast ships usually could get flanking position on opponents but this is where formation and strategies gets interesting...However, current long range ship battery recharge rate is prohibitive and leave them exposed and kinda useless after they depleted themselves. That again, is balance issue.

I'm not unfavorable to rethink the movement phase. But, development wise, I feel that the biggest flaws right now is the absence of terrain influence (asteroids, planets, nebula...) and the fact that I really want to incorporate the principle of upgrade cards that you can append to ships.

Could somebody draw a planet on a hex map with a color code of 1 to 5 hex away from the planet? Planet could be like... 2 hex radius or something...just to get a visual.
''I swiftly matured into a fine example of my species and with my parents' assistance, achieved independence.
Specifically, they pried me from the doorjamb, and rolled me into the street.'' -Fwiffo

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The Troglodyte
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Re: Card-Control: The Ur-Quan Masters

Post by The Troglodyte » Thu May 26, 2016 10:19 pm

glory_device wrote:We tested the fast ship move first type of thing and it actually made even less sense... since you needed to plan ahead gaps for possible limpets or anything similar. Fast, short range ships could be kitted easily by the slowest ships. Easiest example was the Arilou: you close in on your target...but it moves away since it is slower than you in almost all cases.

Fast ships usually could get flanking position on opponents but this is where formation and strategies gets interesting...However, current long range ship battery recharge rate is prohibitive and leave them exposed and kinda useless after they depleted themselves. That again, is balance issue.
It definitely makes sense to go in the order of slowest to fastest ships, I'm just saying that without the consideration of inertia, I can't see a scenario where an Ur-Quan Dreadnought could adequately defend itself against say, for example... 3 Shofixti Scouts.

Each Scout would never have to be concerned with accidentally thrusting too hard and finding themselves in a position where they'd be unable to avoid a Fusion Blast the way they would in actual Melee. Therefore, as long as they're mindful of the Dreadnought's firing arc and range, each Scout could zoom in one-by-one and detonate at point blank range alongside the Ur-Quan, which I don't think would really be fair or reflective of how that battle would actually unfold if four players were operating each ship in "video game"-mode.
“He tasks me. He tasks me, and I shall have him! I’ll chase him ’round the moons of Nibia and ’round the Antares maelstrom and ’round Perdition’s flames before I give him up!” ― Khan Noonien Singh

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Dyandod
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Re: Card-Control: The Ur-Quan Masters

Post by Dyandod » Fri May 27, 2016 3:09 am

The Troglodyte wrote:
Dyandod wrote:Oh my, I will have to try this out soon. Looks fun, Quasi!
The game is loads of fun!! You'll really like it!
Would anyone like to play with me?
KYAAAAAIIIIIIIIIEEEEEEEE!

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The Troglodyte
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Re: Card-Control: The Ur-Quan Masters

Post by The Troglodyte » Tue May 31, 2016 8:18 pm

Dyandod wrote:Would anyone like to play with me?
Hey guys! Looks like we have another volunteer for game testing!
“He tasks me. He tasks me, and I shall have him! I’ll chase him ’round the moons of Nibia and ’round the Antares maelstrom and ’round Perdition’s flames before I give him up!” ― Khan Noonien Singh

glory_device
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Re: Card-Control: The Ur-Quan Masters

Post by glory_device » Wed Jun 01, 2016 1:59 pm

well, you guys can go ahead and start a game then :twisted: !
''I swiftly matured into a fine example of my species and with my parents' assistance, achieved independence.
Specifically, they pried me from the doorjamb, and rolled me into the street.'' -Fwiffo

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Quasispatial
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Re: Card-Control: The Ur-Quan Masters

Post by Quasispatial » Wed Jun 01, 2016 2:02 pm

glory_device wrote:well, you guys can go ahead and start a game then :twisted: !
Congratulations, Trog! You just got volunteered!

Edit: After all, we need to see how this game performs when neither participant is actually a developer of the game itself. I have the best understanding of the rules, but that is precisely why I am the least useful in terms of testing. All the problems with miscommunication, poor phrasing/explanations and the like shows better if the players are less familiar with the stuff in question.
"Sentient life. We are the Ur-Quan. Independence is intolerable. Blah, blah, blah." - the Spathi High Council, Star Control II.

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The Troglodyte
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Re: Card-Control: The Ur-Quan Masters

Post by The Troglodyte » Thu Jun 02, 2016 2:40 pm

Quasispatial wrote:
glory_device wrote:well, you guys can go ahead and start a game then :twisted: !
Congratulations, Trog! You just got volunteered!

Edit: After all, we need to see how this game performs when neither participant is actually a developer of the game itself. I have the best understanding of the rules, but that is precisely why I am the least useful in terms of testing. All the problems with miscommunication, poor phrasing/explanations and the like shows better if the players are less familiar with the stuff in question.
Very well Quasi, I am at your disposal...as well as the contents of my waste disposal system.

Whaddya say, Dyandod? Do you accept my challenge?
“He tasks me. He tasks me, and I shall have him! I’ll chase him ’round the moons of Nibia and ’round the Antares maelstrom and ’round Perdition’s flames before I give him up!” ― Khan Noonien Singh

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Dyandod
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Re: Card-Control: The Ur-Quan Masters

Post by Dyandod » Sun Jun 05, 2016 12:39 am

The Troglodyte wrote:Whaddya say, Dyandod? Do you accept my challenge?
Hey man, sorry for the late reply, but yes I accept!
KYAAAAAIIIIIIIIIEEEEEEEE!

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