The perished races

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Lobsterman
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Re: The perished races

Post by Lobsterman »

Alvarin wrote:Ilwrath are the fanatics. They would try until the last one spider is dead.
Or until the last Thraddash is dead?

For logical reasons I feel it is a lot more likely that the Thraddash is extinct than the Ilwrath. First off, the Ilwrath moved to attack the Thraddash at their home system. If we assume both races have people living on the planets and not just in space (which would be rather odd) the Ilwrath can potentially kill off the entire Thraddash race (even planetside) whilst even if they lose there will still be Ilwrath left on the planets in the former Ilwrath sector.

Plus, the Thraddash got thinned out on two fronts, both from the Ur Quan and the Ilwrath, and as fanatic as the Ilwrath may be, the Thraddash culture is founded upon reckless worship of combat that has already led to several near-extinctions caused by their own race alone.

All this aside though, I like to think there are still a few of both races left. What I'm getting at is that if one race is extinct now, it is more likely to be the Thraddash.
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Re: The perished races

Post by TSC »

I think the Thraddash and Ilwrath would defacto be extinct and where not intended to re-appear in a sequel.

However if *I* did a sequel, whilst I wouldn't have them in it as active races, I DID think of a funny joke that the Pkunk could make on trying to reeducate Ilwrath and Thraddash survivors and trying to teach them that war and violence are not the answer, and considering it a success because 'the last teacher only needed his arms reattached after the lesson, we're making progress!' So I'd reference a handful of them having survived.
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Lukipela
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Re: The perished races

Post by Lukipela »

So if they are both gone, who gets to stake a claim to their worlds and their technology? Neighbours? Victors? No one?
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Re: The perished races

Post by TSC »

Lukipela wrote:So if they are both gone, who gets to stake a claim to their worlds and their technology? Neighbours? Victors? No one?
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Re: The perished races

Post by Steve-O »

Lukipela wrote:So if they are both gone, who gets to stake a claim to their worlds and their technology? Neighbours? Victors? No one?
Well, the Chmmr would probably reassert control of Ilwrath space, since it used to belong to the Chenjesu at one point.

Personally I think the idea that either of these races are extinct is ludicrous, for reasons which have already been covered by other posters in this thread. Their populations decimated, sure. Their fleets destroyed, sure. Neither race is in a position to control any appreciable region of space, hence their spheres of influence disappearing, but the idea that every last one of either race was destroyed is ridiculous. The idea that every last one of BOTH races are gone is even more ridiculous, unless proponents of that hypothesis are suggesting that the very last Ilwrath in the universe killed the very last Thraddash at the exact same time that he succumbed to the last Thraddash's final blow. (Which I have to admit does sound like something that would happen in a game like this.)

In any event, it seems like no race is capable of stealing tech from another race while they're still alive, so I don't see why it would be possible after they're dead. If you can't commandeer an Ilwrath Avenger and take it home for reverse engineering without first exterminating every last Ilwrath in the universe, how are you going to do it when they're gone (especially considering that "it's a well-known fact" that every race's ship design REQUIRES a captain of that species to pilot it.)
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Re: The perished races

Post by oldlaptop »

Steve-O wrote: In any event, it seems like no race is capable of stealing tech from another race while they're still alive, so I don't see why it would be possible after they're dead. If you can't commandeer an Ilwrath Avenger and take it home for reverse engineering without first exterminating every last Ilwrath in the universe, how are you going to do it when they're gone (especially considering that "it's a well-known fact" that every race's ship design REQUIRES a captain of that species to pilot it.)
It probably would be possible in theory to salvage (say) a damaged Avenger and design a new ship utilizing that technology. The New Alliance of Free Stars just couldn't do that as a small guerrilla force based from a standard Hierarchy service station.
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Draxas
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Re: The perished races

Post by Draxas »

Steve-O wrote:In any event, it seems like no race is capable of stealing tech from another race while they're still alive, so I don't see why it would be possible after they're dead. If you can't commandeer an Ilwrath Avenger and take it home for reverse engineering without first exterminating every last Ilwrath in the universe, how are you going to do it when they're gone (especially considering that "it's a well-known fact" that every race's ship design REQUIRES a captain of that species to pilot it.)
That's not really fair to say. Precursor relics being integrated into starships is a major element in both SC1 and 2. There's also the confiscation and integration of the Ur-Quan warp cell, Chenjesu crytal amplification tech, and the Melnorme selling all kinds of upgrades. It's more likely that most other races aren't all that interested in each others' technology (or just can't get what they do confiscate to work right), except for the more advanced Ur-Quan, who take great pains to avoid having their hardware fall into anyone else's hands.
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Re: The perished races

Post by Death 999 »

Steve-O wrote:The idea that every last one of BOTH races are gone is even more ridiculous, unless proponents of that hypothesis are suggesting that the very last Ilwrath in the universe killed the very last Thraddash at the exact same time that he succumbed to the last Thraddash's final blow. (Which I have to admit does sound like something that would happen in a game like this.)
Thraddash world is wiped out. Last thraddash strike force suicidally charges Ilwrath defenses, releases enough weapons to kill all the Ilwrath, and are shot down.
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Re: The perished races

Post by Steve-O »

Death 999 wrote: Thraddash world is wiped out. Last thraddash strike force suicidally charges Ilwrath defenses, releases enough weapons to kill all the Ilwrath, and are shot down.
First of all, as discussed above, this assumes that every last Ilwrath in existence went to Thraddash space to fight. Are there not factory workers among the Ilwrath population? Newspaper editors? Waiters? Elderly or infant Ilwrath who are too infirm to fight and therefore stay home? No matter how fanatical your society is, there are some people who can't go to the front lines of a war, even though they might want to.

Either that or you propose that the "Ilwrath defenses" are back home in Ilwrath space, despite them having gone to the Thraddash. Even then, this "last strike force" would need to locate and wipe out EVERY Ilwrath colony in Ilwrath space, which would likely require a fair amount of ammunition. Even if those colonies are without defenses, it takes a certain number of bullets to kill innocent civilians, too. Is this "last strike force" composed of half the Thraddash armada? Why did they hold such a large number of ships in reserve? If they had committed more troops they might've beaten the Ilwrath invasion more easily.

And after all that, let's not forget the Ilwrath have CLOAKED SHIPS. All it takes is one ship, hidden from sensors, that is unable to join the battle with the last Thraddash strike force because it was too far away to get in range before they were "shot down."

In short, you have to make some drastically poor tactical choices on both sides for there to even be a remote chance that both races would be entirely destroyed. Even then, the odds are long. You can believe this is the case if you want to, but I remain unconvinced. As I said before, the survivors might be scattered and incapable of asserting a presence on an interstellar level, but they aren't extinct.
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Re: The perished races

Post by Maloo Oture »

However, in-game text implies that the Thraddash have nuclear weaponry. This could significantly increase the chance of total annihilation.
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