Your Opinion of the Androsynth

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Lukipela
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Re: Your Opinion of the Androsynth

Post by Lukipela »

Saria, I agree. If one wanted to de-emotionalise them, it'd probably be easier with drugs. They were clones, not bio-engineered little wonders with valium glands.

And Death, thanks for the story. It was heartening.
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Angelfish
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Re: Your Opinion of the Androsynth

Post by Angelfish »

Lukipela wrote:Saria, I agree. If one wanted to de-emotionalise them, it'd probably be easier with drugs. They were clones, not bio-engineered little wonders with valium glands.
They were little wonders, created as slaves. And if we have the tech now to determine the genes that make someone produce less or more serotonin, who says that in the future the tech to create an altogether emotionless androsynth impossible? Like I said, an depressed androsynth, a multi million dollar asset for a company, is worthless, and how else would their owners make sure they will perform at their peak performance? I mean, something has to be done to be able to cope with the stress of being infertile.
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Saria
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Re: Your Opinion of the Androsynth

Post by Saria »

Angelfish wrote:They were little wonders, created as slaves. And if we have the tech now to determine the genes that make someone produce less or more serotonin, who says that in the future the tech to create an altogether emotionless androsynth impossible? Like I said, an depressed androsynth, a multi million dollar asset for a company, is worthless, and how else would their owners make sure they will perform at their peak performance? I mean, something has to be done to be able to cope with the stress of being infertile.
I think the little wonder part came from they cloned an already exceptional person in terms of both physical and mental prowess because they didn't have the capabilities to do that from scratch. There's a difference of detecting said genes and modifying them.

And drugs, lots and lots of drugs.
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Lukipela
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Re: Your Opinion of the Androsynth

Post by Lukipela »

Well, keep in mind this is just my interpretation. We don't actually know, so I'm not saying your version is any more implausible or impossible. But I'd assume that part of the clones education is some pretty heavy brainwashing and conditionalising, with infertility as a final protection. You might not even need to tell them their infertile.

But again, I don't see being infertile as a big problem if someone knows they are that from the beginning rather than suddenly discovers it while trying to conceive. And I think controlling emotions is hard to do genetically, especially if you need to keep creative juices flowing. I really think we're now just drifting into a loop here, where you feel infertility means that they must be drugged/have emotions turned off and I think training and drugs is a more valid path to take. And that's all right, this is an opinion thread after all ;)
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Angelfish
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Re: Your Opinion of the Androsynth

Post by Angelfish »

Lukipela wrote:Well, keep in mind this is just my interpretation. We don't actually know, so I'm not saying your version is any more implausible or impossible. But I'd assume that part of the clones education is some pretty heavy brainwashing and conditionalising, with infertility as a final protection. You might not even need to tell them their infertile.
The last part is hardly believable for me. You've got the most intelligent slave on the world, performing research into various areas, but never in his life he's able to study himself or humans? The brainwashing is a good point, and probably required aswell.
But again, I don't see being infertile as a big problem if someone knows they are that from the beginning rather than suddenly discovers it while trying to conceive.
I think it becomes quite hard if an androsynth falls in love with a human and then figures out that he is not meant for love. It would ruin him emotionally. Also, currently, the most intelligent people in the world all have their share of psychological problems. The most brilliant people in the world are lacking in social skills. I imagine the same problems being present in the Androsynth unless the person who created them had figured out a way of controlling their emotions beforehand. I'm sure this has been a concern with the scientists in zurich. Their main worry was to create a superhuman slave that is able to perform superhuman deeds, but still controllable by their lesser creators, the humans.
And I think controlling emotions is hard to do genetically, especially if you need to keep creative juices flowing. I really think we're now just drifting into a loop here, where you feel infertility means that they must be drugged/have emotions turned off and I think training and drugs is a more valid path to take. And that's all right, this is an opinion thread after all ;)
Still, the psychology thing has to be explained in order to determine what the androsynth are now ;).
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Re: Your Opinion of the Androsynth

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Angelfish wrote:Still, the psychology thing has to be explained in order to determine what the androsynth are now ;).
Orz?
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Re: Your Opinion of the Androsynth

Post by Coleslaw »

A couple of things have come to mind while reading through this thread.

The Androsynth were conceived prior to 1990 (SC1 release year), and the science of genetics and cloning has come a long way in the last 20 years. It seems odd to think that 1990 was really two decades ago.

Sterility
The Androsynth were genetically engineered to be sterile. Being highly intelligent, and probably having more than a few human sympathizers, the Androsynth should have been able to reverse this change in their genetic code. If something as primitive as a human made them, shouldn't a mentally superior enhanced human be able to reverse it? It brings to mind the Clans from the Battletech setting, you have your pureborn who still are grown in mechanical vats from preserved biological databanks, and you have your freeborn who are made the old fashioned way. Once the Androsynth are free from Earth, they would be able to restore their reproductive ability (Appleseed anyone?) but not discarding the artificial womb. The artificial womb would also explain why many androsynth look the same, they would have originally been bred in large homogeneous batches. This would be for identification, because of course all the androsynth look the same, what would it be like if they all looked like regular people (BSG new series anyone?)

Once the Androsynth are free, they would A. restore reproductive function B. Establish their own culture C. Establish their own personal identities.

We know they did pretty well for themselves, there a many ruined cities on their homeworld, which would indicate that they were able to successfully breed, colonize, establish an industrial and commercial infrastructure, and had enough spare resources left over after Starship construction and such to explore IDF technology. Up until they ventured into That Which Man Was Not Meant To Know, they were doing pretty good for themselves.

I can see the first generation Androsynth, those who fled earth being the bouffant wearing Parker Lewis Can't Lose clones I see from the manual illustration. The traditionalist faction would certainly favor this, and perhaps that was the phenotype best suited for space operation (Slave mining, operating as crew of dangerous missions, etc)

I also cannot help but think of the Coordinators from Gundam SEED
Caterpillars, mushrooms, used bubblegum, spiders, calamari, meta-mollusks, and clones of Parker Lewis? The Hierarchy can be defeated with a can of Raid, and a trash bag!
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Re: Your Opinion of the Androsynth

Post by Coleslaw »

Angelfish wrote:
Still, the psychology thing has to be explained in order to determine what the androsynth are now ;).
Dead



The Orz decimated their homeworld, and it looks like the fight was done with nuclear bazookas. There is nothing to suggest that the damage inflicted was done solely by the Orz. I can see the desperate Androsynth fighting back the Orz as they emerged into realspace using every weapon at their disposal, including nuclear weapons. It, IMHO was a battle that was fought with extreme savagery. i do like the notion that there are other Androsynth still alive, on Ur-Quan mining colonies, military outposts, and starbases (ala Star Control 1 scenario battle) and serving on Ur-Quan dreadnaughts.

Being millenia old, I would think that if an alien species you subjugated all just up and died at the same time, across your sphere of control, that is something that warrants at least a little investigation. The Ur-Quan would have noticed the Orz and subjugated them or just destroyed them for being annoying. But if one of your slave races claims their homeworld was decimated in a nuclear exchange, the Ur-Quan would be much more "Your Bad" and left matters as they were.
Caterpillars, mushrooms, used bubblegum, spiders, calamari, meta-mollusks, and clones of Parker Lewis? The Hierarchy can be defeated with a can of Raid, and a trash bag!
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Angelfish
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Re: Your Opinion of the Androsynth

Post by Angelfish »

Coleslaw wrote:
Angelfish wrote:
Still, the psychology thing has to be explained in order to determine what the androsynth are now ;).
Dead



The Orz decimated their homeworld, and it looks like the fight was done with nuclear bazookas. There is nothing to suggest that the damage inflicted was done solely by the Orz. I can see the desperate Androsynth fighting back the Orz as they emerged into realspace using every weapon at their disposal, including nuclear weapons. It, IMHO was a battle that was fought with extreme savagery. i do like the notion that there are other Androsynth still alive, on Ur-Quan mining colonies, military outposts, and starbases (ala Star Control 1 scenario battle) and serving on Ur-Quan dreadnaughts.

Being millenia old, I would think that if an alien species you subjugated all just up and died at the same time, across your sphere of control, that is something that warrants at least a little investigation. The Ur-Quan would have noticed the Orz and subjugated them or just destroyed them for being annoying. But if one of your slave races claims their homeworld was decimated in a nuclear exchange, the Ur-Quan would be much more "Your Bad" and left matters as they were.
The Androsynth were superhuman beings experienced in IDF and well beyond our abilities. Creating a ploy to fool humans even as enlightened as Zelnick would be a piece of cake for the Androsynth, and it has worked out quite well for them. They even have the Orz to guard their back, powerful nemesis warships with fish creatures in them who attack everyone who asks about them. The Orz are not doing a coverup of evil acts committed by them, they are doing a coverup of the fact that the androsynth are in a different place now.
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Re: Your Opinion of the Androsynth

Post by Dragon »

Death 999 wrote:I had a dream night before last, and as I began to wake, elaborated upon it.
An Androsynth (before the exodus) learned to play the piano; his owner would bring him out on stage and have him perform. He walked out very crisply and expressionlessly, bowed like he had been folded and unfolded by a construction robot, sat, and maintained a stony face as he played.

But the music was as rich and nuanced as anything ever played. And each time he played it was a fresh interpretation, a new creation.

People didn't know what to make of it. Some said this proved Androsynth were people. Others said it was a sham somehow. And others were just left with an uncomfortable feeling and tried to dismiss and forget.

When the Androsynth left, the owner was sad but not surprised. He felt like he had done everything he could to make things better... but that he knew it had not been enough, either for this particular androsynth or for them as a category. And he knew that his androsynth had known - for the last thing he had played was a piano reduction of Haydn's farewell symphony.

He thinks that if he had figured out what that had meant, he would not have raised a finger to stop it.
I felt I had to go back to this and add: Death, you have a special class of dreaming :D but I liked your comment.
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